[crenca]

Here is a summary of the responses to the 'PRI mags' thread:

Poster # 1 (myself): 1 defective mag out of 1 - 100% failure rate
Poster # 2: 7 defective mag out of 22 - 32% failure rate
Poster # 3: by his own reckoning, 15% failure rate or 50% failure rate depending on which guns he uses.
Poster # 4: 3 defective mag out of 10 - 30% failure rate
Poster # 5: 100% non-tweaked lip failure, but poster disagrees that this should be marked as defect.
Poster # 6: Does not have working gun, has never used his PRI mags, but "likes PRI workmanship"
Poster # 7: 3 mags out of unknown number with sticky follower - unknown % failure rate
Poster # 8: Does not feel 'failure to drop' failure is a defect (blames varying lowers), and does not reveal or address other defects - unknown % failure rate
Poster # 9: Admits 'failure to drop' defect, but does not say how many and also blames lowers - unknown % failure rate
Poster #10: none of his PRI's have tweaked lips, admits "ka-ching" of his ammo against his feed lips, and complains they bend too easily - unknown % failure rate (or is it 100% given he admits ammo is "ka-chinging" ?)
Poster # 11: 1 sticky follower mag out of 11 - 9% failure rate
Poster # 12: 2 out of 16 mag with 'sticky follower' defect - 13% failure rate
Poster # 13: 100% failure to tweak lips, admits he has "have an issue with the PRI's I did tweak the mag lips..." - unknown (or is it a 100%?) failure rate.
Poster #14: no defective mags, 0% failure rate.

Besides some quibbling with the numbers, at least one of you does not think the failure to fall from well is an issue PRI specific, and one other believes lips should not be tweaked.

Despite these very high failure rates, most of give PRI A+ or A rating. Why is this???

My speculations:

- 6.8 users are just happy to have any working mags at all. When your choice is between bad, worse, and unworkable, bad is (relatively speaking) the best.

- PRI business practices: PRI immediately replaces defective mags, and throws in peace offerings, which gives folks a warm and fuzzy about them.

- High tolerance for poor product in "black rifle" niche of gun industry for various reasons

What am I missing?

 

[BillBond]

I think you are missing the fact they had a bad batch a while back,
PRI has fixed their problems and you are now beating a dead horse.

 

[crenca]

Billbond,

Is the product turnover in mags slow? I ask because here is what I have gathered:

1) The "sticky" follower issue was known problem in the "old" (non-waffle) product. At least one poster said he was hoping the "new" (waffle pattern) product would fix this issue. In some recently purchased PRI mags this is still an issue (i.e . in the "new" product). In fact, irrespective of "old" vs. "new" a majority of PRI owners report this is at least some of their mags.

2) The tweaked lips has been implemented in Barrett and CP. The latest PRI mags do not have this implemented.

How can the above be attributed to a single bad batch? I suppose it's possible if turnover was slow and it took a long time for this batch to be sold, but slow sales is not what I am hearing about.

Even if you do attribute this to a single bad batch, what do you think of PRI's efforts to recall/replace?

 

[paulosantos]

There are PRI, C-Products, and Barrett 6.8SPC Mags. If you don't like the PRI mags, you have other options. I had 3 that had issues and they replaced them with ones that work. I don't understand the big deal. I also think they had a bad batch. I now have 5 PRI 25 Round Mags that work. What else can I ask for? If someone else has problems with their PRI mags, they should replace them. That simple.

 

[crenca]

"I don't understand the big deal."

For me personally the deal (not that it's "big" compared to most things in life is this:

New rifle, new PRI mag. about 20 banged up rounds (more really, I put some back through that I probably should not have), and about a week of trying to figure out what's going on. That's a $1500 purchase I was about to return.

Turns out it is the mag - a $45 device easily replaced. After a little checking around, turns out this mag has (depending on who you ask) a 5-15% (sometimes more) failure rate.

Ok, despite this very high trouble rate the 6.8 community consistently rates these mags as A+ mags. HOW CAN THAT BE?

Seems like simple honesty would compel folks to admit that we have some grade inflation going on here.

On another forum, I mentioned these things (and my speculations as to the reasons why) and I get "Dude, PRI are great mags". Yet, the data (such as it is) indicates the opposite.

Perhaps someone can tell me how a bad batch explains the failures through time, the "sticky" follower problem that was known part of the "old" mags can also be part of the "new" mags. You have at a minimum two bad batches here - and let's be honest it is probably more than that.

Do you guys accept 5-15% failure rates in all the equipment you buy? Ammo for instance? If so, what is it about the "black rifle" market niche that this is acceptable (if it really is)? You certainly don't accept it other realms where you put your hard earned $cash$ on the table, why this one? Seriously, inquiring minds want to know

 

[paulosantos]

Magazines have always been the biggest problems with guns. I've had some of the early CProducts mags that needed tweaking. I had 3 Barrett mags that had big time issues. I had the newer CP Mars that functioned perfect. I still have two of the PRI mags that have thousands of rounds with no problems. It is the growing pains with new calibers. Shit, even some 556 mags have issues on occasion. That is why you test all of your mags and equipment.
I still read where people bash Cproducts mags because they had issues with the older version. Yet they don't bother to tell anyone that they never tried the new ones. It is human nature to bitch and complain about everything. If I have a problem with something I just send it back for replacement. I paid a whole $2 to ship them back to PRI. Went to the post office and placed the 3 in a padded envelope and sent them back.

As far as the answer to your questions, I don't have an answer to them. I have a laid back attitude and deal with things differently. All I know is that I now have 5 PRI 25 round mags that work so they that is all that I'm worried about. The one thing I learned about Mars is that once you have good ones, they generally last.

 

[Jamesb74]

Have to agree with Paulo. You took 14 posters and from just that info came up with a 5-15% failure rate? How about posting the same thing on ARF and on the XCR forum. Most polls don't even start thinking about the info until they break 100 or 1000 people polled.
If you don't like PRI then so be it. I have all 3 brands and have had to tweak two of them the most expensive and the second most expensive. Never touched the cheapest one.
If you want everytime someone posts somthing about PRI you can make the offhand remark about how they suck just like the C-product haters.

 

[bolster]

I don't have 20 PRI mags. I have 11. I bought one used that has a sticky follower. That means I have a 9% failure rate. It is insanely high.

I had 8 C-products mags of the old kind that were ALL bad. They weren't a little tight in the magwell. They didn't have tweaked or non-tweaked lips. They simply would not feed a round into the chamber, when my PRI mags (also without tweaked lips) did. I sent them back, and C-products also made peace offerings. By your rationale, this is totally unacceptable. This is also a 100% failure rate.

The only thing I did differently than you is I did not go off spamming every forum known to man with anti-C-products crap. I waited until I started to hear good stuff from users and bought some more to try out.

Another thing I did was respect the responses I got from fellow shooters and not try to tell them they were too stupid to know what a failure was. I didn't start semantic debates with people over what a failure was, and I sure as hell didn't question people when they said something worked, or didn't.

You insult everyone's intelligence when you try to tell them they don't know what's what, and you are the total noob, with 1 magazine that didn't work, and maybe a month's experience with 6.8. You are a statistical outlier, way off in your assessment, with blinders fixed in place, with your head stuck in the sand, unwilling to accept what people who have far more experience than you have said. We can't help you, other than to tell you that you're wrong.

 

[paulosantos]

crenca, since you started this thread, you can say the last word before I lock it. It is pointless to continue.

 

[Equalizer_2]

To summerize all that has been said:

When a firearm has a problem feeding ammunition to the chamber - REPLACE THE MAGAZINE!

 

[crenca]

Hey, I know when I am beat. Shut er down!