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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
http://www.7mmvalkyrie.com
The 7mm Valkyrie AR is a wildcat hunting round being developed for the AR15. It is based on the 6.5x47 Lapua case with the shoulder pushed back to allow it to run in the ar15 at 2.295 oal and necked up to 7mm. Case trim length will be 1.596-1.60 and case capacity should be in the 42-43.5 grains of water.

It is designed around the 140 class of bullets which should be pushed to 2700-2800 fps from a 24" barrel. Most 150 and 160 class will also be able to run in it with the 160 sierras being able to run at 2.25 oal so they will work perfectly in 300 black out mags. Estimates are for 2600 fps from the 160's. 120 class bullets should be in the 2900-3000 range and the 110's in the 3000-3100 range
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The 7VAR With the 2.295 oal PRI 6.8 magazines work best allowing 7 rounds in a 10 round mag. The larger mags don't allow much more capacity because the magazine starts to swell.


The Valkyrie is a reloader only caliber for now. The case forming requires neck turning and reaming, neck thickness needs to be .012 - .0135. As stated 6.5x47 lapua brass is the best brass to make the cases from. It forms the easiest, lasts the longest, is small primer and handles the pressures the best. Also there is zero loss rate when forming.


6.5 creedmoor cases also work but the brass is softer and only lasts 2-4 firings on average. It also has a loss rate of 10% when forming from creases/folds in the neck/shoulder area. It does have the highest case capacity. Winchester 308 brass also works but you still have a 10% loss rate when forming. Any 308 based case can be used but case capacity suffers, work to make them increases so that is why they are not on the recommend list.


There will be 3 guys offering brass conversion for the 7 VAR, 270AR and the 257 Bobcat. Already processed brass will also be available in a limited capacity to start.

You can join in on the talks with us on our facebook group page https://www.facebook.com/groups/7mmVar/


Dies will be from Whidden gunworks with their competition micrometer seater die which is one of the best in the industry.

Some of the powders expected to work well with the Valkyrie are: CFE 223, Leverevolution, xbr 8208, H335, AA2520, Tac, Xterminator. Also r15 and arcomp might also work well also n530,n540 and n550 should be workable powders.

We are taking the community development route with this round. We have 15 founders and 10 of those are testers ready to test barrels from 16.5" to 26". Reamers will be due mid march with testing starting with a savage bolt gun 26" barrel. Then 5-8 weeks later the ar barrels should be done and come online for testing. Eisenach Arms is in on the development and will have a limited edition upper receiver with the Valkyrie logo.







7 mm Valkyrie tenetive time line

Jan 8th ordered reamers

March 10th Reamers due

March 15th Chamber first test barrel – 26” savage will also make 2 dillon trim dies and 3 forming dies before sending reamers to whidden.

March 16-19 Order dies -- payments for dies are due by april 1st 5-8 weeks to get dies from the 1st -- they make custom dies first 2 weeks of month.

April 3rd Tester’s barrel payments due – tester barrel order date – (sooner if we can) or any founder that wants their barrel.

May 13th Dies will be done soon.

May 15th Tester barrels should be arriving soon

June 1st All testers should have barrels and we should be in full test mode.

June 15 – July 1 if all testing is good order rest of founder’s group barrels – barrel payments due for final group.

August 1st will start taking orders for first group buy, will only be open for 2 weeks. want to place order by aug 15 so barrels can be in hands for hunting season.







Comparing the Valkyrie case to the 270AR case. I opted to push the shoulder back a little further so we could run all 140 class bullets at 2.295 and most 150 and 160 class bullets. It just gave more room to play. first is the 140 nosler bt next is the 120 nosler bt, then the 270ar case, 139sst all of them at 2.295. on the far right is a 270ar case just necked up and a 139sst seated. it has to be seated at 2.35 to keep the ogive out of the case.





I will be using the pressure trace system to collect pressure data during testing.





Here is estimated data, it should be close I used information gained with the 270AR and the 257 Bobcat to hopefully come up with some close estimations.













 

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Very cool! So the company will be offering complete uppers and there will be formed brass available in limited quantity? I really hope some of these more potent cats get noticed and commercialized. You guys are doing great work. Love reading about it .
 

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Dawg, I hope you are planning to try some 7x57 Mauser brass to see if you can eliminate the shoulder doughnut and maybe the neck reaming on forming. Since most of the powders listed in the QL tables are ball type, using a #34 primer in that case would work just like it does for the Remington brass for the 6.8.

Do you have any preliminary prices on the dies and barrels yet?
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
Dawg, I hope you are planning to try some 7x57 Mauser brass to see if you can eliminate the shoulder doughnut and maybe the neck reaming on forming. Since most of the powders listed in the QL tables are ball type, using a #34 primer in that case would work just like it does for the Remington brass for the 6.8.

Do you have any preliminary prices on the dies and barrels yet?

I have tried some 7x57 brass for 270 and it didn't work the shoulder collapsed i have 3 pieces left and when i get the Valkyrie die made i will trim the case first and then try them again. the other option may be to start sizing with a 308 die then with the valkyrie. but i will probably run out of cases i was only sent 5 because that is all i thought i would need.

This is just tenative but it is what i am shooting for.
the barrels will be 4140 cmv 1-9 or 1-8 twist you can choose and come with bolt that will be headspaced to the barrel. I will also be polishing the chambers and feed ramps
7mm Valkyrie Starter kit $699.00 plus shipping Includes:
1 - up to 24" barrel/bolt you can choose your exact profile you want.
1 - Whidden custom die set
100 - Formed cases - 6.5x47 lapua brass
1 - T-shirt
order to delivery 6-9 Weeks
Individual prices:
18-24" barrels 395.00 plus shipping
<18 375.00 plus shipping
full fluting 100.00
Whidden custom die set 180.00 shipped
6.5x47 lapua brass conversion service 45.00 plus shipping per 100 includes anneal and wet tumble when done.
Craig Black, Bruce Finnegan and Rick Banulis will be offering the conversion service and will have already formed brass down the road.
 

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You answered my question before I could ask it--that is--the comparison between your new cat compared to the 7-08 big frame AR. I've been planning on a 7-08 build off the Nexgen and custom barrel. From your numbers it still looks like the big frame AR 7-08 packs more punch using the 139g SST as an example.

Do you have any of the 7mm VAR's up and running yet?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
You answered my question before I could ask it--that is--the comparison between your new cat compared to the 7-08 big frame AR. I've been planning on a 7-08 build off the Nexgen and custom barrel. From your numbers it still looks like the big frame AR 7-08 packs more punch using the 139g SST as an example.

Do you have any of the 7mm VAR's up and running yet?

my predictions put the Valkyrie 50-100 fps slower than a 7-08 but it will match some factory ammo, the ammo in the graph is superformance. it has less case capacity so it will be slower but it should be right on the heals of it in the ar15 package.

no there are none up and running yet. reamers are due mid march so with any luck i will start shooting around the 15th of march. with 9 others starting about 6 weeks after that so it should go quite quickly. going to develop a load book for it also at the same time.
 

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Some exciting stuff!
 

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I have tried some 7x57 brass for 270 and it didn't work the shoulder collapsed i have 3 pieces left and when i get the Valkyrie die made i will trim the case first and then try them again. the other option may be to start sizing with a 308 die then with the valkyrie. but i will probably run out of cases i was only sent 5 because that is all i thought i would need.

This is just tenative but it is what i am shooting for.
the barrels will be 4140 cmv 1-9 or 1-8 twist you can choose and come with bolt that will be headspaced to the barrel. I will also be polishing the chambers and feed ramps
7mm Valkyrie Starter kit $699.00 plus shipping Includes:
1 - up to 24" barrel/bolt you can choose your exact profile you want.
1 - Whidden custom die set
100 - Formed cases - 6.5x47 lapua brass
1 - T-shirt
order to delivery 6-9 Weeks
Individual prices:
18-24" barrels 395.00 plus shipping
<18 375.00 plus shipping
full fluting 100.00
Whidden custom die set 180.00 shipped
6.5x47 lapua brass conversion service 45.00 plus shipping.
Craig Black, Bruce Finnegan and Rick Banulis will be offering the conversion service and will have already formed brass down the road.

All things considered, that's not too bad a price. However... Based on prior experience, and recent experience with the Wolverine, Hornady can do the dies for about $80 less, and the barrels seem a bit high compared to what Wolverine barrels have been going for with bolt. When you consider that you'll have to factor in a receiver, hand guard, etc., that's getting pretty close to what a full on 7mm-08 upper would cost. That could make it difficult for some people to get into building one.

On the case forming, we found on the Wolverine that cutting off the excess length first and then running the cylindrical body into the sizer (well lubed of course) to form the new neck and set the shoulder back. Then just trim to square up the mouth and get it to trim-to length. I can't think of any reason why the same procedure wouldn't work with the 7x57 case. I also took the decapping spindle out on the initial forming pass to take any excess stress off the neck during forming.

In the meantime, I'll do my best to squirrel away the ducats.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
All things considered, that's not too bad a price. However... Based on prior experience, and recent experience with the Wolverine, Hornady can do the dies for about $80 less, and the barrels seem a bit high compared to what Wolverine barrels have been going for with bolt. When you consider that you'll have to factor in a receiver, hand guard, etc., that's getting pretty close to what a full on 7mm-08 upper would cost. That could make it difficult for some people to get into building one.

On the case forming, we found on the Wolverine that cutting off the excess length first and then running the cylindrical body into the sizer (well lubed of course) to form the new neck and set the shoulder back. Then just trim to square up the mouth and get it to trim-to length. I can't think of any reason why the same procedure wouldn't work with the 7x57 case. I also took the decapping spindle out on the initial forming pass to take any excess stress off the neck during forming.

In the meantime, I'll do my best to squirrel away the ducats.

yes hornady can do for less if you buy 50 sets but the first run is still over 100 a set with setup costs. and i can't afford to buy 50 sets of dies. they also don't have the micrometer seater die.

I have a wolverine and love it. but these 2 can't be compared. The valkyrie is a high power hunting round. The wolverine is what the 556 should have been, excellent velocity in a small package that runs in mil spec mags. It can be loaded in bulk and serve many roles from home defense to medium range hunting. I hope the Valkyrie too fills a roll for long range hunters that want to use an AR.

as far as price they are not set in stone and things may change. the price as it stands is comparable to harrison's price on his 270ar and you have to remember this is no milspec bolt it is the 800 series bolt and extension from ARP which carries a higher price. This round and the rounds like it are not for everyone and i know that. for those that do i will make it available. the brass work will also deter many. but to have a very well performing 7mm in an ar15 i think it is going to be a cool and hard hitting round

we will see when rounds start down range.
 

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yes hornady can do for less if you buy 50 sets but the first run is still over 100 a set with setup costs. and i can't afford to buy 50 sets of dies. they also don't have the micrometer seater die.

I have a wolverine and love it. but these 2 can't be compared. The valkyrie is a high power hunting round. The wolverine is what the 556 should have been, excellent velocity in a small package that runs in mil spec mags. It can be loaded in bulk and serve many roles from home defense to medium range hunting. I hope the Valkyrie too fills a roll for long range hunters that want to use an AR.

So, Hornady doesn't do one-off customs anymore? Wasn't aware of that. In any case, I wasn't talking as much about caliber as about process. The process of wildcatting from design, to getting reamers, barrels, and so on. I think the hardest part is actually finding the right parent case. Any wildcat that one wants to be successful has to have a case forming process that is simple, relatively inexpensive, and able to be done by the average Joe. That's one reason why I'm interested in seeing if the 7x57 case will work.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
So, Hornady doesn't do one-off customs anymore? Wasn't aware of that. In any case, I wasn't talking as much about caliber as about process. The process of wildcatting from design, to getting reamers, barrels, and so on. I think the hardest part is actually finding the right parent case. Any wildcat that one wants to be successful has to have a case forming process that is simple, relatively inexpensive, and able to be done by the average Joe. That's one reason why I'm interested in seeing if the 7x57 case will work.
No hornady will do one offs if I wanted one set for 150 or a little more. I need 15 sets to start. to get a decent price from hornady there is a 25 set minimum and with set up fees it would be around 2500.00 plus shipping maybe a little more my cost.

With whidden they will use my reamers and make as many as I want.

I agree for a cat to go main stream it has to be simple to make. I don't know if this would get there or not. I think of it as wanting the most performance from the ar15 that I can get with reasonable case prep. I figured it would start off as a niche caliber till there is a easier brass to use.

Will report back on the 7x57. The body seems thin enough that if I can get them to form they should work well.
 

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BD beat me, so Nevermind!


Go Valkyrie!
 

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i will pm you get me a price and i will buy 25 to play with. thank you sir.

If they're already fired, I'd recommend annealing them after you cut of the old neck and shoulder area. I also used anhydrous lanolin as the lube for forming cases. Best stuff I ever found for that purpose.
 
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