[jasonpeterson]

I have 3 xtremes and have broken in 2 of them using Tubbs Final Finish. I wanted to do a test and break one in the old fashion way. Just to see if the final results were any different. It was beautiful outside so I figured this would be the perfect day to do the break in.

My number one xtreme has well over 1000 rounds through it. It shoots amazing. It is the least picky rifle I've ever owned. It shoots under an inch with almost all loads. I broke it in using Final Finish loads. Then the shoot and clean method to burnish the barrel. Here are some groups with it from yesterday.

Continued on next post.......

 

[jasonpeterson]

Part 2

Today I loaded up 100 grain Remington PSP bullets and 28.5 grains of 10x to do the break in with. With the Remington bullets you can actually load to the rifling. If you load these to 2.30 in a PRI magazine with a xtreme uppers chamber you will be in the rifling. I seated mine .015 off the rifling. OAL was 2.282". I also loaded some 100 grain speer HP's with the same load but with an OAL of 2.301"

Each of my xtremes groups from 1.5 to 2 inches shooting groups right after heavy duty cleaning. After some fouling shots they are awesome. Well this one was no different. I shot and cleaned in between each round for 12 rounds. Making up 4-three shot groups.


Group 1

Group 2

Group 3

Group 4

Continued on next post......

 

[jasonpeterson]

Part 3

Then I shot 4 - three shot groups cleaning in between each group. There was hardly any copper fouling after the second group.

Group 5

Group 6

Group 7

Group 8

I cleaned one final time and then shot 5 fouling shots at a steel target. I let the barrel cool down for about 5 minutes. Then I shot 4-three shot groups. I was very pleased with the results.

Group 9

Group 10

Group 11

Group 12

I could not believe the groups during the break in got smaller and smaller. I wrote notes and shot numbers on each target so when I got home I would know what was what. When I started measuring they were almost in perfect order from largest to smallest. These uppers shoot best when you get 8 to 10 rounds down the tube.

The Tubbs FInal Finish is by far the way to go. They maybe more expensive, but they save you alot of time. It took me over 3 hours to break this one in. It's much easier to clean in between the 5- ten shot groups with the Tubbs rather than after each shot. With the Tubbs you can feel the barrel get shoother alot quicker. Both ways smooth out the barrel. I will more than likely use Tubbs Final Finish from now on.:a21:

 

[Strawdawg]

Thanks for taking the time to make the comparison. I think a lot of us have been wondering about the difference.

Great shooting/great guns!

 

[MichiganMilitia]

So Jason, would you say that the Tubbs method is better for the gun? Does it increase overall acurracy? will it increase longevity of the barrel? Or is it just an easier way to break in a new barrel?

 

[jasonpeterson]

I believe using the Tubbs makes the process easier and you get a smoother bore. The upper that I've shot the most cleans up so easy. My max loads have increased from the time I started shooting it. The barrel seems to be getting smoother and smoother. I think with the chrome lined barrels the Tubbs are the way to go. As for accuracy. I didn't shoot any groups before breaking them in. They seem to be getting more accurate with more rounds. My xtremes are way more accurate than I ever imagined. Little 16" combat upper shooting 3/4" groups all day long. I think they are amazing. :a01: All Tim's little details that he does makes a big difference. By far the best, most consistent uppers I've ever shot.

I think it will increase longevity of the barrel. Less pressure, no fouling, clean less . I think you could do more harm with a cleaning rod used the wrong way than shooting a dirty barrel. That's one reason I would lean toward the tubbs method. Less chance of screwing something up while you are doing all that cleaning.

 

[jasonpeterson]

Check out all these patches.

 

[MichiganMilitia]

Thanks for the quick reply Jason. Keep on shootin! :a21:

 

[Lucky]

Jason, you're being way too modest

On your group sizes..You should be measuring the holes either center to center from the farthest apart or from the ouside of one hole to the inside of the farthest hole..That will close those groups up, don't cheat yourself..

That is is an excellent report and keep up the good work..

Robert

 

[pep]

Good Info

Thanks for the info. I think I will use the Tubbs. All I need is my Xtreme upper, hopefully it will arrive before hunting season.

 

[ccoker]

cool
I have not really had a chance to shoot my Recon for groups

I wonder if with the handlapped Recon barrels if there would be any real benefit to using Tubbs
I ran about 50 strokes of Jb bore paste in mine
then cleaned it, shot 10 rounds, cleaned it, shot 10, cleaned, then like 20-30rds, clean and then 50 rounds and clean
basically 100 rounds of a practice load and less than 10 of my hunting load

will get out this week and really test for groups


funny, like you, I measure outside edge, not center to center
I think in terms of "all shots covered by a dime, nickel or quarter"

 

[ron169]

Correct me if Im wrong, but you are suposed to subtract .277 from the outer group size to get the group, center to center, correct. Nothing like consistant .5 in groups with a best of .402 inches

 

[jasonpeterson]

That's how I measure groups. Depends on the targets you are shooting also. If I use regular printer paper the holes are much larger than the diameter of the bullet. If I use really good paper targets the hole is smaller than .277. I measure the actual hole and subtract that amount.

 

[G3Ranch]

Don't give up on Losso paste. I did my Recon MK68 with it using H's directions. Painful, yes. Once 175 strokes are done with losso paste, I did not clean between shots. 60 Rounds total. The groups kept getting better and better as more shots down the bore. When I cleaned after 60 Rounds (barnes CR10) the first patch had a very faint blue. 2nd patch nothing/pure white. Barrel was eaily cleaned. I shoot the 1.5 x5 SPR Leupy, groups were .75 with 90 TNT SSA. A better scope I could get those groups down there even more. I just cleaned after another 100 rounds the other day to look for copper, no blue on any patches.

I think both are good methods. But I believe the barrels are of better quality than either of the methods so desired...If I would buy another Recon or Extreme I would not do either method, I would just pull the trigger. Which says a lot about the quality of both Extreme and Recon...

Michael

 

[Lucky]

Jason, I was in no way

That's how I measure groups. Depends on the targets you are shooting also. If I use regular printer paper the holes are much larger than the diameter of the bullet. If I use really good paper targets the hole is smaller than .277. I measure the actual hole and subtract that amount.

Being critical of how you measure group size..I have always had the understanding and perhaps I'm wrong, but many shooters measure the way I do..Competition shooters often speak of ultra small groups where all holes are virtually in one or maybe slightly overlapping..How do you measure that? Do you subtract bullet diameter from it ?

I sincerely felt you were shooting much better that your calipers were showing and wanted to give credit where credit was due.At least on this board guys can discuss and debate in a civil manner and I have learned so much from so many I'm just thankful to be here and learn about the 6.8.

Robert

 

[marinesg1012]

When you are using good target stock BR guys will subtract the bullet diamiter, or they will use a device that is made to be the same size as the bullet to score targets.

 

[jasonpeterson]

I just do groups for fun. You are just looking for a center to center measurement. The easiest way for me is to measure the widest points and then subtract bullet diameter. There are several ways to do the same thing. Like Lucky stated, measure from inside of one to the outside of the other. That would eliminate the subtraction step. When measuring one hole groups you would still subtract out the diameter.

Actual bought targets have much cleaner bullets holes. When you use printer paper the holes measure larger. So to get the center to center measurement you should subtract out the actual measurement of a single bullet hole. In that paper.


I went to the farm yesterday evening. My 6.8 is minute of turtle accurate. I shot several turtles with 100 grain speer hp bullets. Talking about fun. I was watching them explode.:a01:

 

[Lucky]

Jason

That's how I measure groups. Depends on the targets you are shooting also. If I use regular printer paper the holes are much larger than the diameter of the bullet. If I use really good paper targets the hole is smaller than .277. I measure the actual hole and subtract that amount.

jason, you know I looked at the pics with your calipers and although they read showing edge of farthest hole, I didn't take into consideration bullet diameter being subtracted..You learn something new everyday..Both you and marinesg1012 are right about target quality paper vs printer paper..

If you really want to get confused go over to Bench Rest Central Forums and learn the latest way they measure..I think to each his own, it's what makes you the gun owner happy and not anyone else..

I'll be updating all of you in a few days on my new Bison upper I just received from Ben..I need some bench time, both handloading and shooting to see what direction I'll be taking, but I will say this about some preliminary results using Hornady Factory 110 VMAX, my holes were all touching and I'll leave it at that for now..

This old Kentucky farm boy is very pleased with Ben Triplett and Bison Armory..If I could go to Bellingham, Wa and thank him in person I would do just that...

Robert

 

[jasonpeterson]

jason, you know I looked at the pics with your calipers and although they read showing edge of farthest hole, I didn't take into consideration bullet diameter being subtracted..You learn something new everyday..Both you and marinesg1012 are right about target quality paper vs printer paper..

If you really want to get confused go over to Bench Rest Central Forums and learn the latest way they measure..I think to each his own, it's what makes you the gun owner happy and not anyone else..

I'll be updating all of you in a few days on my new Bison upper I just received from Ben..I need some bench time, both handloading and shooting to see what direction I'll be taking, but I will say this about some preliminary results using Hornady Factory 110 VMAX, my holes were all touching and I'll leave it at that for now..

This old Kentucky farm boy is very pleased with Ben Triplett and Bison Armory..If I could go to Bellingham, Wa and thank him in person I would do just that...

Robert

Post some pictures when you shoot some groups. We need to show everyone how good 6.8's really shoot. Every person I've carried to the range has fell in love with it.

 

[Lucky]

This is one

Post some pictures when you shoot some groups. We need to show everyone how good 6.8's really shoot. Every person I've carried to the range has fell in love with it.

From late yesterday afternoon...29.5grs H322>>110gr Sierra Pro Hunter..CCI SRP>>Hornady twice fired case>>C.O.L. 2.280..Five shot group @ 100yds..I did measure it, was .775 according to how I do it..

Thanks to the guys here, whom did all the research, I have many other options to try and will be doing this in the coming days, plus I will furnish Chrono data..Just give me some time..